|
Post by The Hapsburg Restorationist on Aug 21, 2015 15:03:49 GMT -5
That is precisely the reason I don't think Martin would go with the whole prophecy thing. He made the character's identity too dubious. However, even if Aegon is really a Targaryen, he might just be killed off anyway, just as a plot twist. But then, I don't really know enough to really have an educated opinion on the subject.
|
|
Defender of the Faith
Administrator
Posts: 267
Religion: Roman Catholic
Rank: Großfürst
Age: 16
Favorite Monarch: Bl. Karl of Austria
|
Post by Defender of the Faith on Aug 21, 2015 15:07:43 GMT -5
This pretty much explains the whole prophecy:
|
|
|
Post by The Hapsburg Restorationist on Aug 21, 2015 15:30:15 GMT -5
Interesting video. But (as everyone does with pet theories) I think all stick with my own.
What are your opinions (if you have any) on the subject? Do you think there really will be an Azor Ahai (or two)?
|
|
|
Post by The Hapsburg Restorationist on Aug 21, 2015 15:32:27 GMT -5
By the way, I hope you don't consider this a thread hijack.
|
|
Defender of the Faith
Administrator
Posts: 267
Religion: Roman Catholic
Rank: Großfürst
Age: 16
Favorite Monarch: Bl. Karl of Austria
|
Post by Defender of the Faith on Aug 21, 2015 15:42:55 GMT -5
Well, I have a deep hatred for Rho'llor, so I don't believe in Azor Ahai. I do think that there will be a Prince that was Promised. I do think that there will be three of them, my best guess would be Jon, Dany and Aegon.
And no, this isn't a thread hijack.
|
|
Defender of the Faith
Administrator
Posts: 267
Religion: Roman Catholic
Rank: Großfürst
Age: 16
Favorite Monarch: Bl. Karl of Austria
|
Post by Defender of the Faith on Aug 22, 2015 21:13:51 GMT -5
So, what do you guys think of the religions of ASoIaF?
|
|
|
Post by The Hapsburg Restorationist on Aug 22, 2015 22:01:05 GMT -5
Well, this post I read awhile ago comes to mind: Rh'llor (and your hatred for him) aside, the other religions seem quite well crafted. The Faith of Seven. for example, seems a believable pagan modalistic monotheism. Or do the characters actually believe in seven gods? Also, it seems that religion is not something that most of the characters really use as the standard for their behavior (like some people calling themselves Catholics nowadays ). Side Note: It seems almost ironic that while Martin tried to make his stories more like "history" by avoiding a deliberate good versus evil, to us of Christendom our history in its greatest moments has often really been a battle for good against evil.
|
|
Defender of the Faith
Administrator
Posts: 267
Religion: Roman Catholic
Rank: Großfürst
Age: 16
Favorite Monarch: Bl. Karl of Austria
|
Post by Defender of the Faith on Aug 23, 2015 20:29:46 GMT -5
If memory serves, there is a longer version of the phrase which is a prayer; "Lord cast down your light upon us, for the night is dark and full of terrors."
As to which religions within ASoIaF, I tend to lean toward the Old Gods. If we are picking between pagans, I'll take the Old Gods. I particularly like it's emphasis on tradition, honor and silent contemplation. With the exception of House Bolton, the Northmen seem to be as a whole more pious in their faith.
And the Faith of the Seven isn't polytheistic, it's actually monotheistic.
"One god with seven aspects. That’s so my lady, and you are right to point it out, but the mystery of the Seven Who Are One is not easy for simple folk to grasp, and I am nothing if not simple, so I speak of seven gods." - Septon Meribald.
|
|
Defender of the Faith
Administrator
Posts: 267
Religion: Roman Catholic
Rank: Großfürst
Age: 16
Favorite Monarch: Bl. Karl of Austria
|
Post by Defender of the Faith on Aug 26, 2015 14:16:51 GMT -5
Also, although it isn't about Monarchy, I can't help but think of the restoration movement by the Ironborn saying:
"What is dead may never die, but rises again, harder and stronger."
|
|
|
Post by The Hapsburg Restorationist on Aug 26, 2015 14:33:20 GMT -5
Also, although it isn't about Monarchy, I can't help but think of the restoration movement by the Ironborn saying: "What is dead may never die, but rises again, harder and stronger." That's epic.
|
|
|
Post by The Irish Jacobite on Aug 27, 2015 13:48:14 GMT -5
No, this definitely is not thread hijack, this is general dicusion on A Song of Ice and Fire, with an emphasis on how monarchists can get inspiration from the loyalty and courage of Robb Stark and Stannis Barratheon's followers.
|
|
Defender of the Faith
Administrator
Posts: 267
Religion: Roman Catholic
Rank: Großfürst
Age: 16
Favorite Monarch: Bl. Karl of Austria
|
Post by Defender of the Faith on Aug 27, 2015 15:03:14 GMT -5
To be honest, I never really liked Stannis, he is a kinslayer after all. That alone disqualifies him from succession.
|
|
Defender of the Faith
Administrator
Posts: 267
Religion: Roman Catholic
Rank: Großfürst
Age: 16
Favorite Monarch: Bl. Karl of Austria
|
Post by Defender of the Faith on Aug 29, 2015 9:48:28 GMT -5
No, this definitely is not thread hijack, this is general dicusion on A Song of Ice and Fire, with an emphasis on how monarchists can get inspiration from the loyalty and courage of Robb Stark and Stannis Barratheon's followers. The Targaryen Loyalists are pretty inspiring too, considering they are all either exiled, in hiding or forced to be quiet about their loyalty and still hold themselves to their old oaths and allegiances. In particular the loyalty of Ser Willem Darry and Lord John Connington. All quotes from the Wiki of Ice and Fire. "Willem was staunchly loyal to House Targaryen. He was a grey bear of a man who was half-blind. He had a gruff, kind voice and big wrinkled hands, soft as old leather... When Prince Rhaegar Targaryen learned that he must be a knight, he went to Ser Willem, who was master-at-arms at the Red Keep, to learn.
After King Aerys II Targaryen learned of the death of Prince Rhaegar Targaryen at the Trident, the Mad King sent Queen Rhaella Targaryen and Prince Viserys Targaryen to Dragonstone, presumably with Willem. After Aerys's death in the Sack of King's Landing and Rhaella's death during labour, the garrison of Dragonstone considered selling the two Targaryen children, Viserys and the infant Daenerys, to the new king, Robert Baratheon. However, before the garrison could come to a decision and before Stannis Baratheon arrived for his assault on Dragonstone, Willem and four loyal men smuggled Viserys and Daenerys from the island and fled to safety in Braavos.
However, Willem took sick when Daenerys was five years old (either in 289 AC or 290 AC) and slowly wasted away, dying an unknown amount of time later, leaving the two children to their own devices as the pair were thrown into the streets by the servants of the house."
"Jon Connington is the only surviving son of Armond Connington, Lord of Griffin's Roost, and his wife. He served as a squire in King's Landing, first alongside Prince Rhaegar Targaryen, later for Prince Rhaegar. He was the most headstrong amongst the gaggle of young lordlings who would gather around Prince Rhaegar competing for his royal favour. He danced with Ashara Dayne at the Tourney at Harrenhal and was unhorsed in a tourney at Storm's End by Ser Barristan Selmy.
Due to his connections with the royal family, and because he was a noted warrior, Jon was chosen by King Aerys II as Hand of the King after the dismissal of Owen Merryweather. Aerys wanted someone young and vigorous to match the rebelling Robert Baratheon. When word of the king’s choice reached Tywin Lannister he declared that the Handship had come to soon for Connington as he was too young, too bold and too eager for glory.
After the Battle of Ashford, Connington took over the pursuit of Robert from the Tyrell army. In the Riverlands, near the town of Stoney Sept, he caught up with Robert, who was hiding in the town. Jon's soldiers began a house-to-house search after failing to find him, but they did not locate Robert before his allies arrived at Stoney Sept to oust Connington and his forces. At this point the Battle of the Bells began. The rebel army under the joint command of Lords Eddard Stark, Jon Arryn and Hoster Tully immediately began attacking the royal army. Jon Connington fought back fiercely, personally killing Jon Arryn's nephew and heir, Denys Arryn, and wounding Lord Tully. It was thought that Robert would have killed Jon, but in spite of the determination of both men to find each in the chaos, they never crossed swords. When Connington saw that the battle was lost, he managed to escape and was able to retreat in good order. Jon's retreat was quite a feat considering the fierce, urban fighting would make it hard to hold the army together.
When reflecting on his search for Robert, Jon says that Tywin Lannister himself could have done no better. Myles Toyne tells him that Lord Tywin would not have bothered with the search, but would've burned the town and everyone in it. Not wanting to be branded a murderer, Jon chose a more honourable course of action, wanting the glory of slaying Robert for himself.
King Aerys II held Jon responsible for this defeat and exiled him, stripping him of his lands, wealth and titles. Griffin's Roost was rewarded to Jon's cousin, Ronald Connington. After the war, most of House Connington's lands were distributed to more fervent supporters of the new king, Robert Baratheon. Once on the Iron Throne Robert was not willing to recall Lord Jon from exile, since he had been among Prince Rhaegar's closest friends.
Once exiled Jon Connington joined the Golden Company and served with them for five years. He rose in the ranks to a place of honor at the right hand of Myles Toyne, the captain-general. Years later Jon thinks to himself that he might have been a successor to Myles if his exile had gone otherwise. He thinks had he stayed it might well have been him the Golden Company turned to for command after Myles died, instead of Harry Strickland.
It was said that Jon was kicked out of the Golden Company after being caught stealing from the company's war chests. It was also claimed that Jon died, that he drank himself to death in Lys afterwards. The shame of the lie still sticks in Jon's craw, but he recalls that Varys insisted the lie was necessary,
'We want no songs about the gallant exile. Those who die heroic deaths are long remembered, thieves and drunks and cravens soon forgotten.'
Exactly when Jon became aware of Rhaegar’s son Aegon Targaryen's survival is not mentioned. He went along with Varys's scheme for Prince Aegon's sake but he never liked it. The rumors of his disgrace and death reached Westeros and successfully convinced everyone involved in the game of thrones that he was dead and gone, enabling him to focus on raising and protecting 'Young Griff' in the guise of his father, "Griff". Jon recalls that Varys was adamant about the need for secrecy."
|
|
Defender of the Faith
Administrator
Posts: 267
Religion: Roman Catholic
Rank: Großfürst
Age: 16
Favorite Monarch: Bl. Karl of Austria
|
Post by Defender of the Faith on Aug 29, 2015 10:06:35 GMT -5
Also, the three Kingsguard Arthur Dayne, Oswell Whent and Gerold Hightower.
"According to his fever dream, Eddard Stark and six of his companions (Howland Reed, Lord Willam Dustin, Ethan Glover, Martyn Cassel, Theo Wull, and Ser Mark Ryswell) approached the tower to recover Eddard's sister, Lyanna Stark. They found it guarded by three members of the Kingsguard: Ser Arthur Dayne, Ser Oswell Whent, and Lord Commander Gerold Hightower.
“I looked for you on the Trident,” Ned said to them.
“We were not there,” Ser Gerold answered.
“Woe to the Usurper if we had been,” said Ser Oswell.
“When King's Landing fell, Ser Jaime slew your king with a golden sword, and I wondered where you were.”
“Far away,” Ser Gerold said, “or Aerys would yet sit the Iron Throne, and our false brother would burn in seven hells.”
“I came down on Storm's End to lift the siege,” Ned told them, and the Lords Tyrell and Redwyne dipped their banners, and all their knights bent the knee to pledge us fealty. I was certain you would be among them.”
“Our knees do not bend easily,” said Ser Arthur Dayne.
“Ser Willem Darry is fled to Dragonstone, with your queen and Prince Viserys. I thought you might have sailed with him.”
“Ser Willem is a good man and true,” said Ser Oswell.
“But not of the Kingsguard,” Ser Gerold pointed out. “The Kingsguard does not flee.”
“Then or now,” said Ser Arthur. He donned his helm.
“We swore a vow,” explained old Ser Gerold.
Ned’s wraiths moved up beside him, with shadow swords in hand. They were seven against three.
“And now it begins,” said Ser Arthur Dayne, the Sword of the Morning. He unsheathed Dawn and held it with both hands. The blade was pale as milkglass, alive with light.
“No,” Ned said with sadness in his voice. “Now it ends." "
|
|
|
Post by The Irish Jacobite on Sept 3, 2015 3:26:43 GMT -5
Here is an awesome video rendition of that scene.
|
|